Whew.. Zwei II is a bit tougher than I expected

Discussion in 'Zwei Series' started by BrokenFantasy1985, Dec 5, 2017.

  1. Got rekt because I derped into an optional boss battle I hadn't prepared for and hadn't saved recently either, and then a later boss whipped my hide the first time, but I managed to scrape through with a quarter of a heart remaining. Without spoiling anything, are later boss battles gonna give me such a stern challenge? Will grinding be enough to mitigate that challenge?
     
  2. Trails of Persona

    Trails of Persona Active Member

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    Later bosses can be harder when it comes to dodging certain attacks, which if you at one point want to try and get the best ranks makes it difficult (to get platinum you can't get hit a single time). For me, doing optional areas before moving on with the story, I could either be at a high level, or have plenty of food to get through a boss with little problem.

    Only advice I can give is save often, so if you get in that situation you don't run the risk of losing so much time.
     
    BrokenFantasy1985 likes this.
  3. Thanks! I'll keep that in mind. Good thing that the combat is so satisfying!
     
  4. Cryrobinson

    Cryrobinson Active Member

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    Without spoiling too much, I can say the third major boss took a bit of grinding for me; to get food, of course! I basically had to get enough food to level up in order to do sufficient damage/take less damage myself. But I agree, the combat is very satisfying, and I just find myself running around doing dungeons over since they're so fun! I wish there was more of an Ys Celceta type dodge, the jump feels a bit slow, but not too serious a complaint. :3
     
  5. The game's fun and all, but starting to get a bit burned out on the grind... I really wish they had put in an Easy Mode. The grindiness, along with not being able to save anywhere, anytime, are factors that bring the game down for me.
     
  6. Trails of Persona

    Trails of Persona Active Member

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    The game does have that curve where after so many levels, most of the food you get does very little to help you, even the trade in stuff. I found if I was a level or two below the recommendation of the area, I could still skirt by. Are you way under leveled, or are you trying to over level the areas? Not saying your criticisms are umwarranted, the grind late game especially can be ridiculous.
     
  7. Wyrdwad

    Wyrdwad Administrator Staff Member

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    I have to admit, I find that sentiment a bit odd, since for me, the Zwei games have both always been "anti-grind" titles. They seem pretty perfectly balanced so that as long as you manage your food well, you never have to grind for even a minute, surviving entirely on the food you've been amassing through normal gameplay and through restaurant trades. Zwei:II in particular exhibits this trait, I feel, standing as the easier of the two Zwei games by far (and a fairly easy game in general, by Falcom standards).

    ...Then again, I am referring almost exclusively to the main game and just a few of the extras that you'll come across here and there. If you're trying to platinum each stage and boss, or get every single one of the game's optional unlockables, it's going to be an entirely different beast!

    (Also, I'm not trying to discount any challenge you might be facing, as there are SO MANY factors that go into a playthrough of this game, it's very easy for things to go entirely differently for one player than for another -- and each player has a different approach to things, as well. I just find it fascinating to see the many different approaches and reactions to games like this.)

    -Tom
     
  8. Well, perhaps I haven't managed my food as well as I could have.. I'm not great at dodging traps or enemies so I end up having to use a lot of food on the fly.. It's just not nice having the threat of losing all my progress due to failing to reach a save point hanging over my head. Any possibility of implementing auto-save in future? (Maybe that's unrealistic but I'm curious).
     
  9. At worst, I've been one or two levels under the recommended level; I haven't really had issues with the normal enemies, it's mainly the bosses. Particularly the second and third ones.
     
  10. Wyrdwad

    Wyrdwad Administrator Staff Member

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    I don't see that happening, unfortunately, since it would change the core mechanics of the game -- and that's sort of the golden rule of quality-of-life improvements: they're awesome, as long as they don't inherently alter the intended gameplay experience.

    I do think you'll hit your stride pretty quickly, though, as one thing Nick and I were just discussing yesterday is that the Zwei games are unusual for being fairly front-heavy when it comes to difficulty. In other words, unlike many other RPGs (action or otherwise), you'll have a lot more trouble in the first few hours of each Zwei game than you will in the last few hours.

    -Tom
     
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  11. I understand.. Front-loaded difficulty? That's reassuring to hear. The charm of the visuals, the humour, and the great music are all things that have kept me motivated to continue playing. Thanks to everyone at XSEED for the hard work you put into this release.
     
  12. Cryrobinson

    Cryrobinson Active Member

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    Once I nailed down the jumping to dodge I felt the game get much easier, but I did also feel I had to "grind" a bit for some more food. Sometimes I'd be under the recommended level, and only ever at boss fights did it cause me any frustrations. That being said, it doesn't really feel like a grind, since going back to each stage offers different findings and such.

    Overall, very satisfied with the game (as I have come to expect from Falcom) and can't wait for Zwei!!
     
  13. PasokonDeacon

    PasokonDeacon Member

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    The recent RPGFan review, which mentioned Zwei: TII's combat as janky and repetitive, got me thinking more about what I did to work past any such feelings I had playing the game. I definitely felt like combat in Ordium Shrine hadn't evolved much at all from Secundum Mines, and that Ordium itself was a dull dungeon with cramped hallways and frantic but still uninteresting fights. Gloomgeld Woods benefits from the player having the Claw Gear and Alwen's ice magic, with which you can start causing mayhem. Freezing the harder foes while chucking Kobolds and other minions into each other for the recoil was damn fun. And it's much easier at this point to internalize the rhythm for Ragna's critical strikes instead of chipping down enemy health from afar using Alwen's needle magic. The further you get, the more complex your options become, and that alleviates both difficulty and a feeling of mundanity. But I feel the combat's fun in the first dungeon which you speed through in no time flat, and that Ordium's the only big hump. Dungeons definitely stay flat for the rest of the game, but the dungeons after early Gloomgeld are a lot more interesting in combat, puzzles, and pacing.

    Beating the final boss of Secundum's Lv. 99 dungeon (which was actually closer to Lv. 45) at a low-ish level was fun and hectic. I find the final boss suitably challenging also, even with Blade Gear.
     
  14. Wyrdwad

    Wyrdwad Administrator Staff Member

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    Heh. I liked Ordium, but SOLELY for the staircase crab. That was just such a cool idea for a miniboss that I couldn't help loving it. ;)

    -Tom
     
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  15. Cryrobinson

    Cryrobinson Active Member

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    I took a many break, so I haven't beat the game yet, I'm assuming the lvl 99 dungeon areas are post game? They tempt me so!
     
  16. PasokonDeacon

    PasokonDeacon Member

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    Ordium's spike corridors, crab fight/puzzle (which is great), and the iced sections redeem what I find an otherwise dull dungeon. The water setting feels under-developed.

    Nah, you can do them right as soon as you beat the second-to-last main dungeon.
     
  17. Cryrobinson

    Cryrobinson Active Member

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    Oh okay! Well that's good to know! Very stoked on that. I'm not sure quite how far I am from that stage, but I know I'm nowhere near level 45 o_O
     
  18. Trails of Persona

    Trails of Persona Active Member

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    Don't worry about getting to that level. After doing all the bonus dungeons, I only got to level 32. After a certain point, every level requires 500k experience to level up, so the grind is real. I beat all the bosses because I had copious amounts of food to heal myself.
     
  19. I find replaying the dungeons to get better high scores and find new treasures pretty addictive. I just hope I won't have to grind a lot to beat the final boss.. Yeesh but the Gloomgeld boss was a pain in the ass until I switched up my accessories. The challenge of some of the bosses and mini-bosses does make beating them pretty satisfying. Does anyone know if I should hang on to the Hamburger Steak I received as a quest reward, by the way? Seems like it might be important, I dunno.
     
  20. Cryrobinson

    Cryrobinson Active Member

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    If it's just the food item, I tend to eat them if they give enough experience to make a difference (and I'm not too low on food or anything). :p
     
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