Pc Games To Console

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by BortSimpson, Jul 25, 2014.

  1. AttentionDeficitGuy

    AttentionDeficitGuy Well-Known Member

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    Well, it's also kinda impossible due to XSEED not being a developer and having no programmers (well, one programmer, but she's only a PC programmer and I believe that she's freelance rather than an actual XSEED employee).
     
  2. Wyrdwad

    Wyrdwad Administrator Staff Member

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    How about Ys? ;)

    The Ys games have done well for us across the board, with the PC titles being among our most successful. And so far, Trails in the Sky has been extraordinarily successful for us on PC, too -- it's definitely climbing the sales charts a lot faster than the PSP release did.

    We would've never expected JRPGs on PC to be successful either, to be honest... but Carpe Fulgur proved there was a market for them via the unprecedented success they had with Recettear: An Item Shop's Tale (another highly successful PC JRPG!), and after we dipped our toe in the PC waters as well, we found that there's actually a HUGE market for JRPGs on PC -- much bigger than we ever could've imagined.

    Like it or not, PC has become an absolutely viable platform for the genre, and is one we intend to continue supporting. We're never going to drop consoles and handhelds, of course... but we've had far too much success on PC thus far to consider it a second-class platform.

    It's obvious you're not a fan of the PC platform, ThePlayerOfGames, but to say JRPGs belong on console/handheld and not PC is... well, not supported by the facts, I'm sorry to say. JRPGs belong wherever there's a market for them, and there is most definitely a market for them on PC.

    Oh, also:

    Corpse Party, for one. And that one's pretty notable, as it was SO successful that it wound up getting ported, sequelized (on handhelds *and* on PC, as remember, the official Corpse Party 2 is still PC exclusive!) and turned into an anime series.

    Also, Yume Nikki was pretty massively successful for a while a few years back.

    -Tom
     
  3. BenoitRen

    BenoitRen Member

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    Steam has made buying and managing digital PC games so cheap and convenient that most people buy those games instead of pirating them.
     
  4. darke1024

    darke1024 New Member

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    That plus indie games' release schedules normally far outstrips the pirates ability to patch and redistribute. Piracy on a PC is only a 'threat' to a bad game or a game that's unsupported or badly supported really.

    But for those games the main threat for them is steam's forums bludgeoning them to death, piracy is only a distant second. (Just take a look at Sacred 3 if you want an example of a bad game, named badly and executed badly. I didn't even see it higher then a 4-6 on the sales list on the steam front page. Even the month-old Divinity Original Sin was still selling continently and significantly better then it; and it's supposedly a 'niche' old-school throwback RPG. :p )
     
  5. Clessy

    Clessy Member

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    Theres always a possiblity but the simple fact is Xseed doesnt have the money to hire programmers to do so.

    Now on the other way around however. Things like PSP games can be bundled with embedded with a translated iso and emulator. Just make a little settings pc interface and you're good to go.


    Tell that poop to crysis where the game was pirated around 5 times more than it ever sold. I hate this stupid myth that steam has somehow saved gaming from piracy. Just go to any one of those torrent sites and look at the numbers of downloads on a new release. Piracy is a real thing and pc games will and always have been effected vastly more than any other platform.
     
  6. darke1024

    darke1024 New Member

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    And how many of the downloads were in countries that can purchase it? You know, that can buy it from steam? Or in local stores? I bet your "five times" drops down very quickly, because that's what happens when you look at the stats for movie 'pirates' and TV show 'pirates'. Piracy is so common for shows for popular shows that release in the US, then release in, say, Australia months if not years afterwards that it's become ridiculously common to just download them. Why? Because we can't buy them! No amount of money thrown at someone will let us legally get a copy! So I can totally sympathise with people not in a targeted sales area to do the same.

    Also, nice of you to pick a game released in 2007 too, it's only a year newer then the original TiTS game was released that just came out in English... totally relevant to 2014 stats.
     
  7. BenoitRen

    BenoitRen Member

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    *headdesk*

    That's a terrible idea.
     
  8. Wyrdwad

    Wyrdwad Administrator Staff Member

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    Terrible idea as it may be, that's essentially what the PC ports of Ys Seven, Zero no Kiseki and Ao no Kiseki are. And, like, the entirety of Project EGG's catalog. ;)

    -Tom
     
  9. darke1024

    darke1024 New Member

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    And probably half the catalogue of GoG's non-indie games; most of them are old DOS games in a DOSBox emulator wrapper.

    Running a 32-bit windows program in a 64-bit windows version? You're essentially running it in a wrapper as well.

    It's always been way too easy since around the mid-2000s to just 'solve' a programming problem with one extra layer of indirection since a decade later no-one will notice the extra performance hit caused by the interpreting layer.

    Here's a x86 emulator written in Javascript if you want headache inducement: http://bellard.org/jslinux/ (So x86 code emulated in Javascript, which (in the generic case) is probably being optimised in a 32-bit browser, which is running in WOW64 mode on a 64bit Windows OS, which... (yeah it gets even more complicated after here) ).

    Anyway... err, yeah, PSP emulation is cool. :p
     
  10. Clessy

    Clessy Member

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    Whats the issue with that? PSP emulation runs at full speed on 1ghz andriod phones.... It runs amazingly on modern systems.


    Also think it looks pretty comparable to the pc game.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  11. ThePlayerOfGames

    ThePlayerOfGames New Member

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    Right, you not abandoning consoles is why we don't have a physical version of SC or the HD ports on PS3.

    In the meantime, I get to put up with less console releases and less physical releases overall. That's frigging fantastic. Just dandy.

    Just wanted I to hear. Thanks for assuaging my fears.
     
  12. AttentionDeficitGuy

    AttentionDeficitGuy Well-Known Member

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    Digital releases and the lack of TitS PS3 is a completely separate issue from XSEED's continued support (or lack thereof) of consoles.

    Digital releases are a thing because of cost. As Tom (and others) have said before: physical releases are ALWAYS put into consideration - it sometimes just isn't possible. As in, either digital-exclusive or nothing. If XSEED went all-physical, it wouldn't increase the number of physical releases they publish, it would only decrease their releases as a whole. PC games are pretty much always digital because physical PC releases simply aren't viable anymore in the current market, especially for the niche titles which form practically all of XSEED's releases. Only a handful of brick-and-mortar retailers even carry physical PC games anymore period (those pretty much always your usual AAA suspects, like Bethesda and EA), and it's been a long time since I have been to a dedicated game retailer that sells physical PC games. Even for console games (which seem to be more your speed), there are any number of titles that, again, are literally not viable as physical releases. The digital marketplace is a great boon to these games, as it allows them to be released to begin with - I repeat, if they were not released digitally, they would NOT be released AT ALL.

    As for TitS PS3, XSEED has looked into it (and still are), but there are a lot of roadblocks for that particular release. For one thing, it's a PSP port with no trophy support, and Sony Computer Entertainment America is (for some silly reason) completely allergic to such things, and does not allow them to be published in NA. Even with THAT knowledge, the fact that XSEED is even bothering to continue pursuing that option is a sign of dedication to the console market, far from abandonment.

    (Also worth noting is that the only reason we were able to get TitS SC is because of... the digital PC market. If that was a thing that didn't exist, then it for certain wouldn't be happening; and not only is it happening,but we are ALSO getting the PSP version, an all but dead console - again, console support is POSSIBLE because of digital PC releases.)
     
  13. Amaterasu175

    Amaterasu175 New Member

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    Don't bother, it's not gonna do a thing. Let's not start another digital vs. physical debate.
     
  14. darke1024

    darke1024 New Member

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    Out of the country at the moment, but I really need to take photos of the PC sections of my local game stores in Australia; I've described them elsewhere as less a "PC games" section and more a "Blizzard and MMO games" section.

    And quite frankly I still have no idea who's buying them, since all the PC gamers I know (20+?) are all digital only, because it's both significantly cheaper and much more convenient.

    Consoles I know are somewhat different, but between the crushing weight of PC gaming leaning on them (seriously, how many of the recent console games are ports of PC indie games?) and the inexplicable pricing of mobile phone ports (why am I paying $50 for a low-resolution port of a mobile phone/tablet game? And sorry, but 1080p is low-resolution when you've got knock off IPad Mini tablets running android at 2048x1536 sitting at a cheap $200 and falling...), they're going to have to sort out their digital pricing at some point.
    Not to mention if you care about archiving and playing your game in 20 years time, you want the DRM-free PC version. Not the shiny disc or cart which can get stolen, or destroyed in a house fire and so forth; the one where you can copy it to a dozen backup hdds, cdroms, dvds, blurays, not to mention personal NAS, cloud storage. And you can also encrypt it with your personal private key, print it out and register it with the library of congress if you really want to safe-keep it! (Seriously; Phil Zimmerman did this with the PGP source code back in 1995 to get the thing out of the US so he could sell it to non-US companies.)

    Anyway, sometimes in life you can't get everything you want, sometimes you can only get 90% or less of it. For some people this is going to suck, but with the PS4 going gangbusters, the PS3 is looking more and more outdated and last-gen like the PSP now, so physical is going to become less and less viable, and just basic ports even released digitally aren't necessarily going to be profitable. If physical releases make more money then they cost to print, then good, since the company made what is required to stay alive: a (possibly slim) profit. If they don't, then they won't be made since more then one company has been sunk by a bad release (just ask all the game development companies that have gone under since their last game (whether good or bad) tanked and they didn't have enough funds to make the next).
     
  15. Wyrdwad

    Wyrdwad Administrator Staff Member

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    Also, to add to what others have been noting, here's the breakdown for SC:

    The game was released on PSP as a 2-UMD title, on PS3 and on PC in Japan.

    I think even you'll have to agree, PlayerOfGames, that if we released a 2-UMD PSP title in the current market, it would lose money. I mean, even a 1-UMD game would be very unlikely to turn a profit, but when you have to literally double your production cost for UMDs *and* invest in custom game boxes to hold them (or double your production of game boxes), in addition to all the other costs associated with a physical release, on a platform that's losing traction on a daily basis due to its age and the increased market presence of its successor, there's just no angle from which you could possibly call it a smart release business-wise.

    Seriously, it just wouldn't work.

    For the PS3 version, we really are trying to get it -- we would *love* to release the game on PS3, both physically and digitally, believe me! It's not like we saw that a PS3 version existed and said, "NAAAAAAAH!" -- no, we've been trying everything we can try to get our hands on it. There are just... a lot of complicated licensing issues involved with it that are proving somewhat impassable.

    But we're still trying!

    And for the PC version, AttentionDeficitGuy summed up nicely why a physical PC release is pretty much impossible, but a digital DRM-free release is pretty much just as good, since you can quite literally make your OWN physical release out of that, and preserve it for posterity with the knowledge that it will never stop working.

    -Tom
     
  16. ThePlayerOfGames

    ThePlayerOfGames New Member

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    I don't know what any of the above has to do with XSeed.

    Computers and hard drives burn in fires and can stolen as well. But we shouldn't have physical releases because they can get damaged.....but we should back them up with physical media?

    Safe from everyone except the NSA - no thanks.


    How many times does it need to be said that no one is seriously arguing for a UMD release? Everyone assumes anyone who wants a physical release is expecting a PSP release. It's a stupid strawman argument.


    And in the meantime, those of us that supported the console games get to watch more and more titles migrate over to PC instead of being brought to consoles where we want to play them.

    I have a two year old HP laptop, and the stupid thing overheats and shuts down *all the time*.
    It's not a viable system for me to game on because half the time i can only use it for thirty minutes to an hour at a time.

    On the other hand, I can use my Wii, 360 or PS3 any time I want, as much as I want, and I don't have to worry about drivers or graphics settings or any other garbage.

    Telling me "that's just the way things are" and acting like console gamers are now about as popular as Julius Caesar in a room full of senators is a pretty big flick move to anybody that supported XSeed console games in the past. You seem quite content to string us along, and then turn around and talk about how great PC gaming is suddently. You wouldn't be cheerleading darke's post otherwise.


    And again, this argument makes literally no sense.
    "Digital is cheaper, safer blablabla - but make sure you back it up with a physical release!"

    Just release the goshdarn physical release in the first place.
     
  17. Terro

    Terro Well-Known Member

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    This part always gets ignored :/ Whiners gunna whine.
     
  18. KlausRealta

    KlausRealta Well-Known Member

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    XSEED kind of just released a console release yesterday, so I don't see how XSEED is shying away from console releases and then there's TITS SC, Brandish, Story of Seasons, and Shinovi Versus coming out later this year. Also, it's not like XSEED is going 100% towards PC gaming, especially since all of the PC releases they have done so far and will do in the near future (save for Ys Origin) have already had a console release, so it's not like console gamers are losing out on anything.

    Sure, Trails in the Sky has better visuals and Corpse Party is the original version, but that's because XSEED can't port anything to anywhere. They're just releasing the PC versions of games that they already released in the past.

    I just can't see this being a problem as it stands right now, if anything it's good because they're supporting a market that supports them financially.
     
  19. Yotaka

    Yotaka Well-Known Member

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    You can look at any number of posts on message boards and find that people are asking specifically whether there will be a UMD release of SC. Not that it greatly changes the argument if you're asking for a PC release (have you seriously seen the shelves these days?) and PS3 has its own issues. You also ignored that Tom has said that they're trying for it.

    Alright, why don't you do the math and figure out how much it will cost XSEED to print out their own discs, boxes and manuals, get an agreement to put them on store shelves, find space on store shelves where PC games really aren't a big thing anymore and PSP games are getting really hard to find, then figure out what XSEED will have to charge to turn a profit after the store takes its percentage, then figure out how many sales they're actually likely to get that way that they aren't getting from their existing digital distribution method... or you could trust that Tom actually knows what he's talking about, XSEED has seriously considered the matter and concluded that physical releases for some of these games Just Won't Work.
     
  20. ThePlayerOfGames

    ThePlayerOfGames New Member

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    Half Minute Hero 2 says hello.

    The more pc releases there are, the less there are going to be for consoles. They are abandoning one audience - an audience that has supported them for a long time - for a flash in the pan audience that doesn't care about Japanese games.
     

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