Final Fantasy 7 Remake Discussion

Discussion in 'General Video Games Discussion' started by Ammy175, Dec 7, 2015.

  1. Kikki

    Kikki Active Member

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    Glad people are happy with the new Tifa. She's still pretty well-endowed, but it's nice that she doesn't look like she would have crippling chiropractic problems any more. I wonder if she still does that hands-clasped-behind-her stretch.

    It's confirmed that they don't yet know how many parts the game will have, though. (https://gematsu.com/2019/06/square-...ill-span-the-final-fantasy-vii-remake-project) I saw in some places that people were saying it's already confirmed to be two parts, but clearly that isn't true.
     
  2. AttentionDeficitGuy

    AttentionDeficitGuy Well-Known Member

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    Ah, that's reassuring. Reassuring that it won't be two parts, I mean, not reassuring that Square Enix doesn't know how many parts it will be. I could very easily see that backfiring in a number of ways - Squeenix's long development cycles resulting in the game/series/whatever-you-call-it not being finished for a decade or more, potentially stretching the game out into more parts than necessary as long as sales are good, hogging manpower that could be used for other projects (like FFXVI)... I'd feel better if the folks at Squeenix could at least throw out a ballpark number.
     
  3. Ammy175

    Ammy175 Well-Known Member

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    I'm hoping that now that they have some assets and stuff to work with, that subsequent parts won't take quite as long. I'm guessing 3 parts total, and hopefully all out by... March 2024?

    That's probably a long shot, I know.
     
  4. Cold_Steel_IV

    Cold_Steel_IV Member

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    The idea that it would be 2 parts is a bit of a misunderstanding of a statement made when showing part 1 that the game would be 2 (blu-ray?) discs.

    What they meant was that FF7 Remake Part 1 is just Midgar and will be 2 discs big, not that the whole Remake of FF7 would be 2 discs with part 1 being 1 disc itself.

    Regarding Tifa, I imagine the model/gameplay for her character wasn't at a stage they were satisfied with to show off at the time. For the Wall Market, 2 things have been confirmed regarding it as far as I'm aware:
    That the Honey Bee Inn will maybe be changed/toned down and that Cloud will still crossdress. It seems like they are trying to keep it relatively faithful. The former being changed I expected, though, as I wouldn't be surprised if recreating those moments with modern graphics could potentially bump the rating to an "M" which I imagine they'll want to avoid.
     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2019
  5. AttentionDeficitGuy

    AttentionDeficitGuy Well-Known Member

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    Seems optimistically reasonable, assuming three parts and about two years of development time each for the second and third parts. I wonder, though, how many of their assets, at least as far as 3D models and stuff, will carry over - if part 1 is gonna be all Midgar, there's a whole lot of other locations that we can assume they either haven't worked on yet or just gotten started, to say nothing of the characters who don't show up until after that part of the game (including four party members). Three parts does seem like a pretty realistic assumption, though - I even know where part 2 would most likely end, if they went that route. I think it's probably gonna be at least four, though, if for no other reason than Square Enix knows they'll sell like mad.
     
  6. Ammy175

    Ammy175 Well-Known Member

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    True; I forgot there's stuff other than Midgar (I don't know FF7 that well; sue me).

    Still, I can hope it's only three parts, though. :/
     
  7. AnimeGamer183

    AnimeGamer183 Well-Known Member

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    I am concerned how long its going to take to release all the games. I will consider playing when they are all out. I can only hope they are working on the next entry in the series behind the scenes. Seems like everyone is having a hard time wrapping their head around exactly how many entries/years of investment this thing will be.
     
  8. Cryrobinson

    Cryrobinson Active Member

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    It would be problematic I think having it go on too long. I mean, games aren’t the same as something like a TV series, where fans are used to waiting that long. So I think it would test the patience of a majority of their audience. That, or people will tend to forget, and without anything like gameplay or something to reassure fans they’re already going to enjoy it, it sounds riskier aiming for a lot of episodes over a longer period.

    I think they’ll probably do 3-4 parts, and probably within a shorter window. Maybe 18-24 months. I wan, I’m totally speculating, but I think those things would make more business sense; which sadly, Square isn’t necessarily the best at.

    My hope is that it won’t be too expensive consumer-facing. I don’t want each episode to cost the price of a full game, especially if the 3-4 guesstimate is correct. I have fond memories of FFVII and all, but not that fond.
     
  9. Ryos

    Ryos Active Member

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    If .hack is any indication, every title will be the going PS4 rate ($60 regular, ~$100 collector's). So if there are say 4 titles, it'll be $240/$400. Oof. Good news is there'll be a lot of asset reuse (anyone remember that complaint with the latter FFXIII titles? There'll be so much more of that here) so it shouldn't be too long of a wait between them all.
     
  10. Cold_Steel_IV

    Cold_Steel_IV Member

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    Apologies for the long post. I spent way too much time on this, lol.

    A lot of the work will carry over, like some of the assets and gameplay, but they will still need to figure out the world map, which I imagine will be a big thing to work out, and of course make all the other towns/locations. Ideally it'll be 3 parts with us still being able to
    travel the whole world (on the airship) by part 3
    , but I wouldn't be surprised if they make Part 2 all about some open world gameplay aspect like how Part 1 will be about 1 big city and from there, after working out how the world map will function, will then be able to focus more on the main plot and towns for the last 2. Personally, I think 4 parts could work pretty well.

    If they go with 4 parts, I think it could work with Part 1 being Midgar and Part 2 being
    Kalm, Nibelheim/Shinra Mansion/Mt. Nibel, chocobo farm and that cave/mine near it, Fort Condor, and then all of Junon with it ending after
    the Jenova fight on the cargo ship.
    I feel like there's enough content there to make up Part 2 if Midgar alone can make up Part 1.

    Part 3 can be
    Costa Del Sol, Gold Saucer, all the Corel stuff, Cosmo Canyon, Nibelheim again (though this town would ideally be reused from Part 2), Rocket Town, Gongaga, Bone Village, Temple of the Ancients, and end with the Forgotten City.

    Part 4 can be
    Icicle Inn/Great Glacier, Wutai, Mideel, all the
    underwater areas + space[/QUOTE], and the Northern Crater.
    And hopefully,
    by this point you will have full access to the whole map + airship, since almost all the rest of the map would be places we've already visited/assets already created in the previous parts.

    There could be 1-2 years between Parts 1 and 2, and Parts 2 and 3, but Parts 4 should ideally only take 6 months to a year this way.

    As for what content would make up each part in this scenario:
    For playable characters: Part 1 would have Cloud, Barret, Aerith, Tifa, and Red XIII. Part 2 would introduce Yuffie, Zack, and maybe Sephiroth and/or the Shinra soldiers who accompanied them. Part 3 would introduce Cait Sith, Vincent, and Cid. And maybe you could even have AVALANCHE or Turks as temporarily playable at some point.

    For narrative content, I expect them to work Yuffie and Vincent into the main story, which I don't mind, but Part 1 can obviously end with them leaving Midgar, probably with them overlooking the world (maybe even show Kalm off in the distance) like the ending of the first Lord of the Rings. Part 2 could open one of two ways, imo: Immediately after Part 1 ended as you pick your party and go right into the world map (which I imagine will be open world), or you could open the game a bit differently maybe with us watching Cloud and Sephiroth in the back of that truck as they head to Nibelheim. The latter could work well as it jumps right into things and since Cloud takes a few breaks retelling the story anyway, we could have one right after that introduction showing them in Kalm and showing what everyone's doing (them listening to Cloud talk about Sephiroth) and we can jump right back into the backstory. After that we'll have a chance to explore the small town of Kalm, gear up, pick our party, and then head out into the world. We can get chocobos and enter the mine, have a run in with the Turks, then head to Fort Condor (the forests here are the earliest you can get Yuffie, iirc, originally), and then have everything at Junon.

    They could maybe introduce Yuffie during the run in with the Turks in the mine/cave, or they could simply make a mandatory story sequence/cutscene happen where you're traveling through a forest and you run into her, but if they end up making her mandatory, I feel like they should do it in a story moment rather than just randomly. If they're open to changing/adding some things, they could write the cave scene and introduction to Yuffie a little differently and make it work. They could have the Turks, instead of leaving initially, have a conflict with the party and Yuffie comes along (seeing Cloud's group as having lots of materia) and helps them out. She can then claim to simply be an adventurer who was happy to help and Cloud's group could accept her into the party here, not knowing she would be doing it in hopes of a chance to steal the groups materia. Alternatively, if they want to flesh out here character more and add more story elements and content, they could create a whole new original story sequence involving an introduction to Yuffie after the cave/mine and before reaching Junon that could eventually tie back to Wutai (and maybe the war the Shinra had with them) later. I think either could pretty well.

    Fort Condor can exist here and I, uh, don't really remember what you can do here. I know there's the materia part (but that's way later in the game) and the minigame, though I don't remember when the minigame takes place. I suppose if the minigame is later, they could have a different version of it happen now, like how it seems we'll be doing the bike section earlier in Midgar before the one after Shinra Tower. If I'm remembering correctly, the people of Fort Condor are/were at war with Shinra? This could also be a really really good opportunity to introduce Yuffie since her home was also at war with Shinra and she could maybe be helping them out when we initially meet her. All of this could help flesh out Shinra's role and wars in the world and maybe tie back into some of those aspects that appeared in Crisis Core.

    Nibelheim/Shinra Mansion/Mt Nibel towards the start is a big story portion right there, and Junon could serve as another big sequence for Part 2. Obviously you have the lower town place, saving Priscilla, and the dolphin jump. I wonder how much of this will stay intact in the Remake? I hope all of it, honestly. Junon probably should be the second biggest town in the game after Midgar, particularly with the big streets, landing pad, huge parade, many buildings, etc.. Junon is a great opportunity to add stuff; I don't even know what the rest of the party was doing while Cloud was having to dress up undercover. Maybe it's just my bad memory? You could maybe add a section where you play as the rest of the party minus Cloud and find a different way to get onto the cargo ship and get disguised as some sailors. Cloud having to wear a Shinra outfit again before participating in the march could be a prime moment for another freakout/bad memory for him, too, especially since he'd be seperated from the rest of the party. It should be easy enough to extend the Junon section and maybe allows to explore the town some more or see more of the military side or the town underneath even. This should allow for more pay off and significance for later when Sapphire Weapon attacks the place. The cargo ship will probably be a little longer in the Remake, with fighting some of the guards leading up to the Jenova Fight. They could play up the shock factor of us seeing all the dead guards, "Sephiroth" again, and the surprise of Jenova to make this a bit better of an ending for Part 2. Alternatively, they could have it end in Costa Del Sol, but there's less of a narrative cut-off/stopping point there. The player may feel after running around the town/getting a chance to buy stuff: "why can't I just continue from here?" rather than treating the defeat of Jenova as a victory and with the somewhat cliffhanger-y ending of knowing you've made it and will be able to soon dock at your destination. I also feel that saving Costa Del Sol for Part 3 might be better from a development stand point.

    Part 3 can begin with you in Costa Del Sol, getting geared up, and seeing Hojo before you leave for Mt. Corel. Then you'll get to Barret's hometown and then to Golden Saucer. They'll be able to advertise the Golden Saucer quite a bit since it will appear so early into this Part, haha. This is a very prime moment to add even more to an already packed place. More minigames, rebuilt minigames, easter eggs, add more prizes. Maybe flesh out a number of the minigames already there. More maps for chocobo racing, maybe add a multiplayer. They could add a scoreboard or multiplayer in general for a lot of the minigames here. There's also a guy named Dio, and while I've never watched Jojo, even I know the most important change and beneficial addition they could ever make to this Remake would be to add a Jojo reference somewhere (assuming there already isn't one). Jokes aside, I'd like to see story content here, and the options in it, remain and possibly fleshed out a little more. I'd like more development for Dyne and Cait Sith during the plot here. In fact, I'd like to see them write some things differently for Cait Sith. From what I understand, he's easily one of the most disliked characters from FF7, and I think a part of the reason for that, apart from his betrayal, is his lack of time to development him and how forced and weak his introduction is to the party. I think if they introduce him (possibly without the moogle he rides) earlier in Part 1 as someone Cloud randomly meets in Midgar (which he probably would normally be, due to Reeve being there) for one reason or another, and then have this be their second encounter, would be very beneficial. You could even have Reeve, in general, just appear more in Part 1. Maybe Cloud runs into some unpleasant ruffians in the Slums and Cait Sith helps him out briefly. Then when Cloud and co. meet up with him later he act as though he's taken up fortune telling with his new robo-plush moogle. Him being annoying and forcing himself onto Cloud and co. works narratively, due to him spying on them, but would work much better this way for the player, I would think. At least that's what I would prefer. Anyway, the story would progress after finishing the Corel and Corel Prison, Golden Saucer, and Dyne plot. You should have Gongaga and its reactor as a place available to visit too.

    We have all of Cosmo Canyon up next. I honestly can't think of much they could add here. I guess they could probably keep it reasonably similar to how it is now in the original game.Next up is Nibelheim/Shinra Mansion/Mt Nibel. These areas should all be reused from Part 2, so all you have to do is the story. Vincent is extremely easy to integrate into the main story here. Just lock a door and put the key in Vincent's room and trigger a mandatory cutscene when Cloud enters his room. Then he joins after you leave the room like in the original. Easy! Next up is Rocket Town. Can't think of much that could be added here. Everything can mostly play out the same. We get Cid as a party member and the Tiny Bronco to ride on. Can't remember all the places you can visit once you get the Bronco, but if Mideel and Wutai are possible to get to by this point, as much as I would hate changing this, it might be necessary to push them back until Part 4 where you'd get the Highwind as creating two more towns and the large areas around them might be too much to put into this Part, along with all the other towns and locations already included, to release within a reasonable time or without having to cut anything else in order to include them. Anyway, the Temple of the Ancients would be up next, followed by the Bone Village, Sleeping Forrest, and then finally the Forgotten City, where Part 3 will end.

    Part 4 opens in Icicle Inn and you precede as usual with the Turks/Snowboarding and into the Great Glacier. From there we get to the Northern Crater where everything plays out as it normally does. Next we're back at Junon (whose assets were already made in Part 2) where things play out mostly the same, but I'd really enjoy it if we got a chance to fight the Sapphire Weapon a little bit before its shot, like with Diamond Weapon. After we get the Highwind, we get access to everywhere. Most of the world should already be created from the previous 3 Parts. Mideel and Wutai would be new places we could visit. Cloud is found in Mideel and things play out the same until, well, the end of the game I suppose. Wutai, all the Weapons (and maybe an extra 1 or 2, I'm hoping), Mt Corel/Fort Condor/Rocket Town Huge Materia, Underwater reactor/submarine/crashed Gelnika, Lucrecia's cave, return to Midgar, and finally the Northern Crater will all play out pretty much as normal. Outside of a handful of new locations, all the other places on the world map should be created already and available to the player.

    Phew! That was longer than it was suppose to be! I picked certain spots to start and end based on where in the story they could take place that would give each Part a good starting location/event and ending location/event. I also tried to keep in mind what could be considered a reasonable development time. Part 4 shouldn't take very long comparatively. Maybe less than a year? The hardest part would be managing to have all locations in one game. Part 2 would take about a year or maybe a bit more as the world map, Nibelheim, and Junon would all take a lot of work, I'd imagine. Part 3 might take 2 years if they went this route. We could get Part 1 in early 2020, Part 2 2021, Part 3 2023, and Part 4 2024. Alternatively, we could disperse some of the content in Part 3 to try and balance it out a bit more. As it is now, anyway, Part 2 has probably the least "hyping" ending and putting the longest wait after that could hurt. Maybe we have Part 3 simply be Costa Del Sol, Gold Saucer, all the Corel stuff, Cosmo Canyon, and Nibelheim (which would already be made, barring story stuff) and push Rocket Town, Gongaga (I actually don't even remember where Gongaga usually fits in....), Bone Village, Temple of the Ancients, and Forgotten City into Part 4? Part 4 would have both the Tiny Bronco and Highwind in it and we wouldn't have to push back Wutai and Mideel this way. Not sure how it'd work for Cid, though, since he would be the only person introduced in Part 4, which I feel would be a disservice. It also doesn't give that strong of an ending for Part 3 or stir up a strong desire for the start of Part 4. Maybe we could extend Part 3 just until we escape Rocket Town? We would get introduced to Cid and end with getting shot down as we made out getaway and it would also have us start Part 4 in the ocean with an important destination and some freedom at our fingertips. That could work. Each Part would take about a year to a year and a half, which I suppose would work. Part 2 in 2021, Part 3 in late 2022/2023, and Part 4 in late 2023/2024 most likely.

    That's if they go for 4 Parts, though. 3 or 5 Parts might be workable. For 5 Parts, Parts 1 and 2 would be the same, Parts 3 would be Costa Del Sol, Gold Saucer, all the Corel stuff, Cosmo Canyon, Nibelheim (and maybe Rocket Town/escaping with the Tiny Bronco). Part 4 would be Tiny Bronco freedom, Wutai, Mideel (maybe), Gongaga, Bone Village, Temple of the Ancients, and end with the Forgotten City. Part 5 would be full map freedom, Icicle Inn/Great Glacier, Mideel (maybe), all the underwater areas, and the Northern Crater. Eh. Some of these places are somewhat interchangeable. This would probably ensure a release a year, though. Part 1 2020, Part 2 2021, Part 3, 2022, Part 4 2023, and Part 5 2024. Something like that.

    If they go for 3 Parts, though, Part 2 would probably start with Kalm end with Rocket Town. Or basically start and end with Nibelheim. It'd include: Kalm, Nibelheim/Shinra Mansion/Mt. Nibel, chocobo farm and that cave/mine near it, Fort Condor, and all of Junon , the cargo ship, Costa Del Sol, Gold Saucer, all the Corel stuff, and then Nibelheim/Shinra Mansion/Mt. Nibel again + probably Rocket Town. Part 3 would be Tiny Bronco/Highwind/full world map freedom, Wutai, Mideel, Gongaga, Bone Village, Temple of the Ancients, Forgotten City, Icicle Inn/Great Glacier, all the underwater areas, and the Northern Crater. Part 3 here would reuse all the assets from Parts 1 and 2, too, of course, for when the player returns to those places. Hmm, this could work, but we'd have some long development times. Solid 2-3 years of development minimum for each. I dunno... I feel like it's a bit much to try and fit the whole rest of the game into 2 parts if Part 1 is just Midgar. I don't think it could honestly be done without cutting out a lot, let alone keeping the same quality and fleshing out the game more. If they could pull it off it'd be great, but I feel like it'd be better if they go with 4 parts, personally. We wouldn't go for too long without en entry, each entry would have a lot of content, and they wouldn't have to cut anything out while also having the chance to add more to the game.

    Y'know... after writing all this out, it's really noticeable how many towns and locations there are in FF7. I didn't even really count all the one-off places or all the Reactors (granted, you could pretty much copy/paste them all anyway) or caves or dungeons. Something I've noticed recently when it comes to game development is that good believable towns seem to be especially difficult to create for RPGs. FF 13 didn't have any, FF 15 had to cut down on the two biggest ones, FF7 Remake Part 1 is only Midgar and the company Nihon Falcom also considers it difficult. The President of Falcom has said he wanted to remake his favorite Legend of Heroes games, the Gagharv Trilogy, but that it wouldn't be possible for awhile due to how many towns there are in those games. And you can tell with some of their recent games that they wanted to include towns, whether even just one or a couple, and not being able to finish them and having to cut them. Games in general seem to take a lot longer to develop and cost a lot more than they used to. And games, and towns especially, seem a lot easier to have created in the past then in the present. So I'm trying to be lenient and understanding towards Square Enix with this. I imagine recreating such a big game without cutting content is probably harder than most might think. From what I understand, the reason given as to why it was being released in parts in the first place was so they wouldn't have to cut anything, and that it could be used as a chance to flash out things they never got to originally.

    So far the game looks good, but we'll have to wait to see if they drop the ball on this one. I can't imagine it being outright bad though. It may mess up in some areas or ultimately be a let down, but a lot of what they've shown off has looked good, albeit there are a few questionable things shown so far, so at worst I expect it to be a decent game. It really shouldn't turn out that way though. The Remake has the potential to reach amazing heights, and there's really no excuse for why a FF7 Remake shouldn't be great. I don't have an issue with it releasing in parts if that's what it takes for it to turn out great without cutting the game down, so long as each one doesn't take far too long and has a reasonable amount of content. A lot of development can happen before Part 1's release and they can work on a future Part while still working on a previous one, so them not knowing how many Parts it will be right now doesn't really concern me too much. They've said they're already planning out the scope of Part 2 and they're still 8 months away from Part 1's release. I don't think we can really expect them to say a number right now as they very well could end up having to change it. After they see what amount of content they're able to create in a given amount of time (which they should discover from evaluating the scope of Part 2) they should have an idea of how they're going to go about releasing the other Parts. I expect they'll already be deep into developing Part 2 sometime early next year, so we should probably not expect more news on the future parts before then. They'll want people to focus on Part 1 more than anything when they show it off from this point on. There will probably be a demo and more news later this year at Pax or Gamescom so maybe we'll get more info on the future Parts then, I just wouldn't expect it if they don't know themselves how many Parts it'll be.

    ...My post has once again gotten longer than I thought it would. I had more I wanted to mention, specifically about gameplay and content from the spin-off/movie/etc., but I think it'd be best to stop now. Sorry for making such a long post. Is there anything you guys are hoping they maybe add in the Remake? Any new content you'd welcome? Maybe tie ins to any of the spin-offs and such?
     
  11. Cryrobinson

    Cryrobinson Active Member

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    Well hopefully it's not quite that expensive. Like I said, I have fond memories of playing VII, but I also am not totally absorbed by nostalgia and realize the story is garbage. So overall, I'd like to not have to pay a lot (more like ton) of money if I wanted to play it. If so, I'll probably just give it the good ole skip.
     
  12. Ryos

    Ryos Active Member

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    If the releases do work out that way (an article I read earlier today compared the length of this part to a typical FF series title release, which implies to me they're planning to charge accordingly), you can always just do what I'll probably do and wait until the whole series releases and will inevitably have like an FFVII Remake: The Collection release. :p
     
  13. Kikki

    Kikki Active Member

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  14. DustyStarr

    DustyStarr Well-Known Member

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    Midgar was probably my favorite part of VII so I am happy it is being expanded upon, I just hope it is fairly expanded upon, since it was not a very long segment in the game.
     
  15. AnimeGamer183

    AnimeGamer183 Well-Known Member

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    That moment when you realize we are getting a whole game with Aerith this time around instead of just the first disc :eek:
     
  16. Ryos

    Ryos Active Member

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    I'm kind of surprised but the deluxe version's only ("only") running $80, $20 over regular (seems like a pretty good value for a CE too - that steelbook in particular is pretty smooth). But yeah, it'll be nice to see more time with Aerith in the main game proper, though Aerith got a ton of great screen time in Crisis Core.
     
  17. AttentionDeficitGuy

    AttentionDeficitGuy Well-Known Member

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    You just HAD to bring up that that exists, didn't you! Now I'm eyeing up that steelbook. Ah, well, got over half a year to decide whether I want to spend the extra 20 for that (assuming it isn't limited quantities, in which case it'll likely sell out in a couple weeks, prematurely ending my problem).
     
  18. Ammy175

    Ammy175 Well-Known Member

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    Hey now! Can't forget about the good ole Cactuar DLC!
     
  19. DustyStarr

    DustyStarr Well-Known Member

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    Does the Carbunkle DLC come with Deluxe or just the stupid spend one?
     
  20. Ammy175

    Ammy175 Well-Known Member

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